Posts Tagged → Glazers
The pervious blog shows just how little power The FA really have, I wrote that before they published a response to the Governments requests. The whole document was a complete disgrace and considering there were over 70 different points in the governments recommendation, 16 pages from the football authorities hardly covered any of it. Richard Scudamore comments from the other day show just how much power the Premier League really has….
We’ll make sure supporters have a proper voice but that doesn’t mean they can get everything they want.
… its everything summed up in one sentence. It makes it pretty clear Scudamore is stuck in his own little word…
It’s very hard to come up with legitimate ways to put fans on boards. We don’t have a Germanic model here.
… its very simple. Include a simple rule which means a new place is created and an elected supporter from each clubs supporters trust is put on the board of each club. It doesn’t require rocket science. Most people might think that will never happen in the Premier League. Scudamore needs to be reminded Swansea already have a supporter on the board. On top of that, 64 other clubs outside the Premier League have supporters on their boards. Considering there are just over 170 supporters trusts thats a huge chunk. Considering more clubs are being taken over by the fans season by season and the shareholdings are increasing season on season. Scudamore is living in the same world as FIFA. Completely out of touch and clueless. Apart from the other facts on directors, does he know 26 clubs are owned by the fans?
Most of the clubs which are owned by the fans are from League One and below but they have been increasing in number. Clubs like Exeter, Wrexham, Wimbledon and Chester are examples of larger clubs which have struggled but have been reborn. Tranmere Rovers and other supporters trusts already have viable plans to takeover their clubs but the current plans from the football authorities limit what can be done. Scudamore comments are that not of The FA, the Government or the fans but the Premier League and its clubs. Scudamore only has the interests of the owners of the clubs at heart and nothing else. Can you imagine the Glazers, Henry, Roman or many of the other owners supporting change from the fans point of view?
The question now is, what is the Governments response to this document? Do they know details we yet don’t? Will they be public and tell us their view? Are they going to ask for more or will they be quiet and slyly accept this? If this is slowly allowed to disappear to allow the Premier League to do as they wish, something has gone seriously wrong. Serious questions should be put forward now to the Department for Culture Media and Sport to find out what the next stage is!
Just before Ronaldo was sold, the only stories about signings from David Gill was ‘we won’t sell Ronaldo’. What did they do, they sold him. Now I’d say at least once a month, maybe more we have the Manchester United Chief Executive commenting on how we can still afford big names but there IS ALWAYS A TWIST. This time the excuse is ‘we are hoping the youth team produces the next big thing’. No one is saying the youth squad can’t produce great players but why is he saying we can compete but then start to make an excuse why we haven’t or won’t spend?
Manchester United have always invested in top young players who have made their mark at other clubs. Am sorry but Darren Gibson is no Roy Keane. Obertan is no Ryan Giggs. Roy Keane was destroying teams as soon as he walked into the side at the age of 21. Gibson is 23, doesn’t seem to be moving forward and still watches the game. Obertan still has a chance but he needs to take it. He’s in his second full season now and needs to impress sooner rather than later. Giggs at his age had played around 100 games and scored 28 goals in the league alone. In the past 10-15 years when a top player has been coming to the end we have always gone out and found gems. Some have been record breakers and expensive but others haven’t. Its not a pop of Gibson or Obertan its a pop at David Gill because we have two other players in the 1st team who remind me of a younger Keane and Giggs. Rafael and Hernandez. Both have been given a chance and now I’d rate them against any other players in the same positions in the league. To me Rafael while young and sometimes seen as reckless, has that never say die attitude. The same is true with Hernandez. The energy, skill, pace and attitude of both show these players are out there, David Gill just needs to pull his figure out of Glazers arse. If there is a young 19-21 year old somewhere in England or Europe who matches their attitude, go and sign him up. Am talking about a quality midfielder. He doesn’t even have to be young. He could be 24 or 25 but a player who can come in and perform. If he costs £3m or £20m, doesn’t matter. Using excuses like their is no value or we’ll use the youth team, while telling me and you, ‘we can sign megastars’ does not quiet wash with me and I don’t buy it. Don’t talk to me about paying £45m a year to insurance companies over some bonds, with £150m sat in the bank and then talk about ‘we can buy £40m players but instead we’ll use the youth team’. Making out as if your going to spend big but never do, is a horrible trick to spilt the support. Its awful tactics. If your not going to sign anyone as you’ve clearly made out, why bother telling the fans there is £100-£150m sat in the bank? If the stadium won’t be expanded and they won’t invest in the team, the only business plan on offer is to try and pay the debt off. They clearly aren’t going to drop Old Trafford ticket prices, so what he’s getting at about signing big names etc makes no sense. He doesn’t say anything important for many years, now he can’t keep it shut.
I do as many blogs on Tampa Bay as I do Manchester United these days because they are also in a pickle. The poor performances of the team during 2009 and 2010 saw attendances at their publicly owned stadium drop. From selling out every home game since 1996 when the American council house was built, they failed to sell out a single home NFL game. Not only that but all their home games were blacked out from tv as stated in the NFL rules. So far they’ve had poor performances, failed to get on TV and seen attendances drop by significant numbers. Now if United started coming 10-15th in the league for two seasons on the run after poor performances, saw attendances drop by 20,000-30,000 over night and then didn’t see a single home game on TV, it would be big world wide news. People would want answers and heads would roll. In the NFL they seem to take a lighter view as its only 4 teams in each league and its a different sport. After all that I’d say this is a victory for all those wanting the debt ridden owners to give some back. They have reduced ticket prices and not just by a couple of % some have dropped by 30%. 10,000s have mostly dropped by 20%. A 31% drop is a ticket in the East Upper In Old Trafford Dropping from £36 to just £24. That’s the sort of price drop in some areas of the stadium. Heres a list of the price drops.
- Adult Tickets
Lower row West sideline:
Last season – $85
Next season – $79
Upper West corner
Last season – $65
Next season – $52
East side upper level sideline
Last season – $85
Next season – $72
East upper level
Last season – $75
Next season – $52
East corner end zone
Last season – $99
Next season – $89
- Youth Tickets now cost $17.50 instead of $35
- Stadium Parking Is 40% Cheaper.
- Season Ticket Holders now receive 10% off all food, drinks and merchandise purchases.
- They have introduced a 10-month payment plan for season tickets.
The Glazers have also had the cheek to say ‘we’ve listened to our fans and made changes’ well they should listen up in England because we’ve been telling them from day one. You made a big mistake.
Alot of people say the Green & Gold is dead and nothing is happening. For me, that’s very far from the real story. This is a waiting game but there are a number of things going on in the back ground. This ranges from now until summer and we should hear news on them. First there is the case of where the missing £249m came from, to pay Glazers debt off. Andersred as ever always has he eye cast out and there is always the likely hood that could pop up again. There are also rumours of a takeover by Qatar but that’s nothing more than rumours. Until it happens we won’t know a thing. If nothing more comes by the summer months there is still hope.
This next piece is in black and white. This will happen. As I type the Government are reviewing football. Its not rumoured or made up. It is happening. They don’t like Manchester United’s debt or the culture of the Premier League. They want to sort it out. By May this year the Government will have completed its review of how to deal with football ownership and football governance. The proposals will be published during May on Football Governance and hopefully through the FA, they will start putting through the changes needed so we and many others can take a stake in their club. They know the problems and hopefully they’ll be robust.
In the last year alot has been said about football ownership but there are still afew totally clueless people who write things they have no knowledge about. Cue Louise Taylor of the Guardian I don’t often get offended but this does offend me. There are certain areas which have been discussed over the last year and most people understand what would and wouldn’t happen. Thinking ‘all clubs’ under supporter football ownership schemes would have all their fans vote online for the first 11 every time they play, means you really don’t have a clue. Ebbsfleet are the worst example of football ownership going and its not slightly comparable with the examples myself and many 100,000s of others would accept. Thinking Manchester United would be taken over by the fans and then the fans would vote online to pick the team is so off the mark you’d have to live on mars to think that’s what me, other football supporters or the Manchester United Supporters Trust would want! To show anyone who doesn’t understand what could happen heres what wouldn’t and would happen.
A takeover of Manchester United by the fans WOULD NEVER see!
- Any online voting system.
- Fans voting on the 11 players that play each game.
- Fans choosing the manager.
- A vote on future signings.
- The fans being able to sack the manager.
A take over of Manchester United by the fans WOULD SEE.
- A board of directors as any other football club.
- The only voting would be for the people who make up the members of the board.
- The members of the board would have the interest of the fans and the club at heart.
- The board of directors would make footballing and club decisions like any other club.
- The board of directors would be forced to follow certain rules after a takeover. Examples – The club cannot be put up for sale. Debt cannot be put on the club. The stadium and training grounds cannot be sold. Tickets prices are to be recommend under deals between the club and IMUSA. IMUSA, MUST and other fan groups are to have official links to the club, these cannot be broken (as Glazer did back in 2005).
- The board would give the manager a set transfer budget. Example – Any mega expensive signings would as with ANY club be considered by both parties. David Gill, the Glazers and the Manchester Board still have to consider everyone who the manager signs. Finances are important.
- The board can be asked to starting to consider other issues such as safe standing, away ticket allocations, final allocations, sponsorship ticket levels, ticket prices and future expansion of the stadium through fan groups such as IMUSA and MUST.
The fans want what is in the interests of Manchester United Football Club but the club also has the interests of the fans. Its a two way street and currently its mostly a one way street. Most fans would agree many areas of ticketing for games away from Old Trafford are poor. This is one area the club can its self campaign but currently does naff all. From the facts above its clear the Spanish, German and FC United routes of football ownership are the correct ways to go BUT every club and its fans, have different issues they want to address. Certain people thinking we as fans plan to vote on the team or have a voting system in place to sack the manager need a reality check. We want the manager to have freedom, the team to have support, the club to be free of debt, the club to be stable and have the fans interests in its mind.
One thing every Manchester United fan will know is the Glazers don’t do publicity. That is until now. The problems this time aren’t coming from Manchester, this time its from on the other side of the pond in Tampa Bay. In the States they are more public than here but when I say more public, this is the first time this season (its ended already) the Glazers have spoken to the press and the fans publicly. There is the odd comment from behind closed doors or at private NFL events but hardly any direct speeches or interviews to the press or the fans. Bryan Glazer said… Many teams ”are happy we’re not in the playoffs because we could have done some damage,” but Bryan your not in the playoffs, you didn’t get any games on tv and you didn’t sell out once. On top of that your fans think your running the team and many of them are worried about it being sold to Eddie Debartalo. Many other NFL fans want the Glazers to sell up.
Bryan Glazer is treating the Bucs much like Chelsea or Manchester City. Over hyping what is slowly becoming below average. The Glazers have big enough problems, that they have to hype up the team publicly and for them to go that far it must be bad. With Manchester United they know this is off limits because they’ll get buried into the ground. David Gill is no longer seen by many people as more than a puppet, its hard to take him seriously unless you have the brain of a City fan. Only a fool says ‘wait and see’. This can apply to the Bucs plan of spending fuck all or Uniteds plan of we have £100m in the bank for players, but we’re not touching it via the managers ‘theres no value’ comments. Bryan would be seen like that before he opened his mouth. In America from the comments I’ve seen, Bryan Glazer could very well be their David Gill. A pointless PR spin machine, picked up by most who read the headline before they read the quotes.
Now the press have finally dropped the World Cup issue for now, I look at it in a very different way. Some may say the Russia and Qatar bids were all about money and you might be right or wrong. I go for right. What ever the question is that doesn’t really matter and England has its own problems to sort out. First off public transport if Cameron is going to promote that as one of Englands big benefit above other countries. The Germans for example have a vastly better organised transport system than we will ever have. The 2022 World Cup bid by Qatar was as serious as any other bid, unbelievable to win or not. With big more already spent one or two stadiums and with the British construction company Arup having already developed the brand new air conditioning technology for the stadiums what is very clear is it was a credible bid. Am sure many of the construction projects will involve British firms and we developed the technology for their bid to be serious. The Qatar winning 2022 bid could be blamed our British know how and knowledge. A number of us Brits will end up over there working building the stadia or other projects which go with it so its not all bad.
If you think the 2022 bid was bad, you should have seen hosts for the 2011 Asia cup bids. It included Iran, India and Qatar. No South Korean or Japanese bids as many people might expect. Also alot of the teams consist of teams like North Korea, Iraq, Iran, Jordan and Syria. States considered by the Americans as Terror states who are their with football teams. You don’t hear Asia screaming out over countries in their bid so many the press have over reacted. Qatar also won the Asia Cup bid by some way and although on a smaller scale, it should how what we can expect. Maybe we English shouldn’t have written Qatar off as a mad choice. A country saying it will be build all new stadiums, spending big money before its won any bid and they easily won the Asia Cup bid. I’d say on the face of it that’s more effort than England would have put in. I know we already have the stadiums but was the Government going to fund expansions of many other grounds or was it down to the clubs themselves to fund this. Clearly in Qatar this won’t be a problem, over here will the UK Government fund a new stadium in Liverpool or Birmingham? No, they won’t. We’d end up what we have now plus one or two improvements if the clubs choose to fund the development with possible part funding by the government. This can no way be compared to what the Russians and Qatar can put forward. So on the subject of Qatar, they are unknown but they are going to host two major footballing tournaments over the next 12 years.
Tournaments aren’t the only areas they have aimed at. Last year Manchester United played and trained there, for which Qatar paid United for. They have in the last week paid Barcelona for their first proper shirt sponsorship deal ever and as ever with Middle Eastern countries next they must have buying a European club on their agenda. Its unlikely they could ever buy a German or Spanish club. That leaves Italian football and English football as two main areas where Qatar may choose to invest in European football, such as Abu Dhabi did with Manchester City. With big money spent on two football bids, a huge sponsorship deal with Barcelona what is next?
It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to work out Qatar buying Manchester United is a possible option. With them reportedly ready to spend £41 Billion on the World Cup which lasts one summer, the country paying £1 Billion or £2 Billion or even £3 Billion for Manchester United which is a very valuable asset, must look like an easy choice for them. A cash cow machine in top European football and with this PIK debt being paid off either via a 3rd party member such as Qatar or replaced with new debt. Both for the Glazers are win win options. They can say to Qatar ‘you can buy United for £1.5 Billion’ and that shouldn’t bother them one bit. Of course they will wait until the correct moment but when the club is sold it will happen fast and take everyone by surprise.
You can follow me on twitter.com and my twitter name is @wewantglazerout
Today the Glazers will report they’ve paid off the £220m PIK personal debt, people will say ‘good news’ on twitter, facebook and the press will report the same thing but they should be asking something very different. Where has that money come from?
A leading news paper called The Telegraph which has sources inside of Manchester United has acquired some information which points to an American company called ‘springfield financial’ http://www.springfieldfinancialco.com/ Apparently they have taken on the Glazers personal debt for a tad lower rate of interest than was on the PIKs. Its not 100% true but its the most likely situation. It would make sense, along with why its been kept so quiet. Good News? err noooo. There is likely still a PIK loan at £240m just at a lower rate of Interest. Love United Hate Glazer.
As we’ve all seen on twitter along with one or two well known business sources the Breaking News is ”United owners to pay off £220 million loan”. This is that famous £138m PIK debt the glazers took out in 2005 to buy Manchester United or should I really say just take control. The bond holders currently own more of the club than they really do, they just don’t get a say and the fans pay the interest repayments. That debt is now worth over £220m and its known it will be paid off by the 22nd November but there are still questions. First and last is. Where has this money come from? This might be answered within an hour of this being posted or maybe never. I know the Glazers through, it always comes out in the end.
Has it come from the club? Well business sources say, No, none of the clubs money will be used to pay it off even through the bond document would allow this to happen. If the source to the business source is David Gill, then yes 100% it did come from the club. He doesn’t really know what’s going on.
Rumour mill has been throwing afew others.
They they taken out debt to pay debt? This is possible. They did this with United bank debt and converted into bonds. This didn’t really do alot. The debt is still there and still has to be paid off sooner or later.
Is a 3rd party involved? This is also possible but I’d say more unlikely than the first. This is interesting. Does the 3rd party get a say on goings on? Do they own part of the club? Who is this 3rd party. Other Yanks? A United fan? One I had put too me was could it be the Red Knights? After the summers goings on I’d find that highly unlikely but its been rumoured debt in the form of the bonds could be used as a possible takeover tool.
Selling the PIK debt to someone who is meant to be on the side of the fans while keeping full control could be an option. For the Glazers it could be a good option and a way out while still increasing the value of the club. Using the clubs money was a no go but selling to a fan friend? To remove some anger and hate? Did we finally bother them that much? With the Government aiming to produce plans, UFEA wanting to introduce certain rules and the increasing protests? Bloomberg reported they were scared to use the clubs cash. Am I getting carried away? Yes, that won’t have happened so don’t even think about it.
Paid Off Or Not. They Still Have To Go.
You can also read more on the Andersed Blog http://andersred.blogspot.com/2010/11/known-unknowns-and-unknown-unknowns.html Follow him on Twitter Here. @Andersed